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candlelight001
07-12-2009, 12:22 AM
The players:
Stan: 5 yro, Aussie Shepherd/ACD mix. Pretty mellow. My fiance's dog for years, mine for two.

Luke: 10 months old, mostly ACD. Adopted 5 or 6 weeks ago. Bounces around, all the time.

The problem:
Luke wants to roughhouse with Stan 24/7. Jumps on him w/ paws on his head, mouths his legs, jumps on him and mouths the back of his neck. When we first got Luke, Stan would snap at him and Luke would stop. Then for a week or so, they wrestled alot. Now Stan basically ignores and avoids Luke, until he's pushed to the limit when he snaps at him. Stan has about 10 pounds on Luke, and when he was engaging in the roughhousing, he had the advantage in my opinion.

Luke's behavior is annoying to us. Unclear if it's annoying to Stan, but it seems like it. I keep hoping they'll sort it out, but Luke is remarkably persistent, and Stan way too tolerant. We dog sat for a friend of mine last weekend, and her old dog put Luke in his place with a growl and a sneer at the beginning of the weekend, Luke then left her alone.

Ideally, Stan and Luke could play together and have some kind of relationship. We got Luke in part so Stan could have some company. If they're not gonna be best friends though, it would be nice if they could sort things out.

My related concern is that Luke is not learning that his behavior is obnoxious and that he'll jump on a bigger/meaner/less patient dog than Stan and get his butt kicked...

So, should I start checking him? Or does the fact that Stan doesn't check him mean that he doesn't really mind?

dingoridge
07-12-2009, 12:30 AM
You have a 5 year old, adult, calm, easy going dog and an annoying 10 month old kid who is pestering the adult. Yep, I would insist Luke cut it out. Poor Stan is trying to go on with his life while this little whippersnapper is aggravating the senses out of him. After Luke grows up some, they may become good friends but in the meantime, give Stan a break and insist Luke have some manners. I would guess Stan minds a lot but he is trying to live in peace and Luke is an annoying snot. And yes, there is a dog down the line that won't have the patience or temperament of Stan and kick Luke's fanny good--no need to wait for that, get control of the situation and Luke--at least that's what I would do.

I have an 11 month old who knows when I tell her to knock if off she had better knock it off, I have older dogs too and if they want to play fine--if they want a little peace, then they are going to get it.
J

Linda Watkins
07-12-2009, 12:34 AM
You have a 5 year old, adult, calm, easy going dog and an annoying 10 month old kid who is pestering the adult. Yep, I would insist Luke cut it out. Poor Stan is trying to go on with his life while this little whippersnapper is aggravating the senses out of him. After Luke grows up some, they may become good friends but in the meantime, give Stan a break and insist Luke have some manners. I would guess Stan minds a lot but he is trying to live in peace and Luke is an annoying snot. And yes, there is a dog down the line that won't have the patience or temperament of Stan and kick Luke's fanny good--no need to wait for that, get control of the situation and Luke--at least that's what I would do.

I have an 11 month old who knows when I tell her to knock if off she had better knock it off, I have older dogs too and if they want to play fine--if they want a little peace, then they are going to get it.
J

What she says....:)

You're in charge of the household -- you need to set the rules; poor Stan is probably waiting for you to help him out.

Mel2001
07-12-2009, 10:15 AM
How about getting a 3rd dog for Luke to play with....?!? :naughty:

MaggieDog
07-12-2009, 11:14 AM
Kes did/does the same thing with my youngest girl. He does, however, now know a cue to "stop bugging your sister" (we use "Gentle") and it's starting to transfer to other dogs as well when he's playing too rough. Here's how we taught it:

- pick a cue from the other dog that reliably means they are uncomfortable (for Z this is a freeze in place with slight head turn).
- whenever you see the body language you picked, give the pup a verbal cue ("gentle" for us) - he won't know what it means at first but this will become your cue for future use after he does.
- give the pup 2 seconds to cease the behavior
- if the behavior stops, allow interaction to continue. If it does not (more likely at the beginning), immediately remove the pup to another room or crate for a timeout of 30 seconds. A dragline can help this go more smoothly as you don't want to have to chase the pup around to get them in timeout and it needs to be swift, not delayed.
- allow pup out of timeout if he is quiet at the end of 30 seconds and allow interaction again
- rinse and repeat

You should see improvement fairly rapidly. For us the first time out was after about 2 mins of play, then 10 mins, then 40 mins, then 2 hours, and now only occasionally when he doesn't respond to his "Gentle" cue.

We went from Z avoiding him as much as possible to seeing her solicit wrestling play and some chase games; interestingly enough, she's also started to correct him more effectively, too, where she used to just take what he dished out without much response other than avoidance. My oldest also has benefited as she tends to be the "fun police" and now has less to police. :)

autiger23
07-12-2009, 07:22 PM
interestingly enough, she's also started to correct him more effectively, too, where she used to just take what he dished out without much response other than avoidance.

Buck was like that, too, when Scout would be too much energy for him- he'd be too 'nice' with his tellings off. I think once they see you discipline the other dog for rough play/annoyingness, they get that it's ok for them to take a hard line with it.

Additionally, I would suggest that if you ever have it where a couple of time-outs aren't working, you may need to take the youngster out to play ball or something for a while. Wear them out a bit, but I'd make sure to do it after a time-out and not after they've been a jerky teen to your other dog. Just so you can re-inforce good behavior instead of bad.

Luke is definitely young and hyper- you need to make him straighten up now for you and Stan's sanity, but I bet he starts to settle down in about 6-8 months. Sounds like a long time now, but it'll go by in a blink, especially after you sort him out. :biggrin2: